The Prose and Convictions of Mr Harry Redknapp
Tuesday, March 30, 2010 at 12:02PM by guest-blogger Tricky
Prologue
There is still much debate about out manager, so much so that when looking into the ‘for and against’ arguments that rage on even today about our beloved / liked / tolerated manager I soon realised that this article might be a bit longer than anticipated.
Each one of these could start their own ’discussion’, but maybe they need to be considered as a ‘whole’ for once because everything would appear to be related – argument and counter, prosecution and defence.
And also because this is a debate that isn’t about to disappear any time soon (court case pending that is) it ended up being something akin to something more Shakespearian play, except there’s less eloquence, plot, intrigue or purpose and more football, and it’s about the same length. There’s also less men in tights and men playing women (with the exception of Sandra who will be played by Mr Darren Bent on this occasion).
So make yourself a cuppa / organise an impromptu ‘meeting’ / or simply just loaf like the rest of us for five minutes before starting this one (having another screen open and the ‘alt-tab’ function are worth remembering for those with PC’s who work in open plan offices) – don’t say I didn’t tell you!
Act 1 - Pro’s
Scene 1 ‘Is thou fit for purpose?’ – make no bones about it, since coming to White Hart Lane, he has made watching our team not only bearable but enjoyable at times, we play a decent passing game and Harry’s record since arrival isn’t too shabby in all competitions (inc replays) – P82 W44 D18 L20 with a win %age that currently puts him 3rd on the list of spurs all time managers. Results matter not just one or two games in isolation, but over the course of seasons and so far he’s got them, undeniably so.
But most importantly he stopped the rot (for those that weren’t aware, when he joined we had played 8 league games with only 2 points accumulated – something often understated).
Scene 2 ‘The merchant of players’ - He found a solution to the DM position, as wild and extravagant as it seemed at the time buying Wilson was perhaps the most influential deal he put together. And yes it was obvious, but then again other managers have failed to resolve ‘obvious problems’ before in the past.
So is he more astute in the market place? Well for me he certainly appears to be no worse than Mr Comolli. Other than Wilson we have added Kranjcar (at an absolute steal of a price), Defoe, Crouch, Bassong, Cudiccini, the twin Kyles, Gudjohnsen (who many questioned the need for him, right up until the point where we, err, needed him), and Kaboul (see comments for Gudjohnsen). Ok so he also bought back Robbie and Chimbonda – but maybe they were simply fit for purpose at the time, we were just lucky enough to not have to rely on them too much when it mattered. Just as importantly there’s not too many ‘Rasiaks’ or ‘Rebrov’ comparisons to be had, and he’s trimmed the squad in the process allowing us to save on operating costs leading up to the stadium redevelopment.
It also removed the need for the DOF role, which in turn (IMO) removed some of the ‘player power’ that seems to have had an undertone in recent years (especially in relation to footballers and agents speaking (in)directly to levy bypassing and undermining the manager), it also meant that the manager will now have a team that he has put together.
Scene 3 ‘Thou ist a true motivator, and inspiration amongst pretenders’ – Few can argue that since he arrived a number of players have improved, Modric is well and truly back on track, Lennon looks his old self again (but with a better end product). The Hudd I’ve always been biased towards his potential, but having been given the confidence of his manager he’s taken the mantle of '1st Choice' on well. Hell even Bentley is starting to look like he has re-paid some of the £15million that a lot (including me) had written off on his seemingly inevitable transfer.
And Super Pav has been nothing short of a revelation since ‘returning to the fold. Whether or not you like the way he has handled certain situations (see Act II below), or how much of it is down to him, the team as a whole have looked more talented and balanced than I have seen for a good few decades.
In particular the midfield of Lennon, Palacios, Huddlestone, Modric early on in the season was perhaps the most perfectly complimentary of attack, defence, pace, skill, passing and movement that I can recall since, well, actually I struggle to think of a combined four that I’ve seen that has been better in my 20-something years of following spurs.
Act II- Con’s
Scene 1 ‘Thou dost talketh too much, about so very little’ - well define ‘too much’, after all one of the criticisms of Ramos was that he didn’t talk to the press at all but sent out a forlorn looking Poyet who would have to justify the actions of his boss.
There is a general obligation by the club to send a representative to pre- and post-match interviews as there is much interest in the game and it is important to the club that these are conducted to gain interest. Harry (like or loathe) does represent a person of interest (be it for controversy or otherwise), right from the start in the manner of the appointment and the clubs respective position and even today as a manager of a club with aspirations, combined with our current lofty position there will no doubt be a lot of press coverage about both us as a club and how Harry as the manager will deal with that expectation and ambition.
Sure I cringe a lot of the time, and true the ‘2pf8g’ mantra did become a bit parody, but what would people rather – too much or not at all? As ’not at all’ probably means that the club was mid-table and our ability to influence anything of newsworthy note was of little appeal or consequence and I quite like the fact that our results have ‘consequence’ these days and for the right reason.
Scene 2 ‘Why doest thou write “tittle tattle” and such unworthy prose for the masses’ – There are two things wrong with having a column in the Sun for me; firstly his job is to manage the team, so what is he doing having a second job (even if he is more qualified to comment than most journo’s, I firmly believe that Managers should manage only whist gainfully employed) and secondly it also adds to the argument that everything he says sounds like it is a gift wrapped sound bite, because it does.
[I am for the sake of not being sidetracked ignoring that it’s also ‘the Sun’, owned by the ‘evil Murdoch empire’ aka “The Top 4’ loving, self agrandisation, ‘sign up now to Sky’ Empire”]
Scene 3 ‘It is unbecoming in your position, good sir, to critique those whom have been “shite” in public’ – Enter stage left Mrs Redknapp. So Sandra could have scored when Bent missed a sitter, and Harry came out and said as much, it was no less and certainly no more than any of us were thinking. Well boo hoo to Bent if he can’t take some criticism, I want players who can see they were poor and work hard to rectify it, not to go spouting unrequited love for another manager / club on twitter.
And the much maligned handling of Pav? The problem with closed doors is that they are exactly that, the only people who saw Pav in training are the team and the staff for the majority of the time, and in this situation we have no Russian twitter to follow to fill us in, only interpretations and agents talking to press. So maybe it was as much to do with Pav having to know that he was going nowhere that bucked him up to make the best of what appeared to be a poor situation. Then again, maybe it was however wrong of Harry to even respond to questions about Pav’s situation at the club.
Thing is, I ‘heart’ Pav, for the player he is, and almost shed a tear when Pav ‘heart’-ed the fans after the Fulham game, but is his agent is as culpable under the circumstances in running to the press every five minute forcing Harry to comment in Jan?
So the difference between the two situations for me is the outcome, as the manager was consistent in what he said ‘train hard and play well when you get the chance’, maybe the players’ attitudes have as much to answer for as the manager at times.
Scene 4 ‘Thou hast the tactical wariness of a poached halibut, good fellow’ – It can be said that the only difference between a good decision and a bad one is often ‘time’. So if he does / doesn’t make a change that does / doesn’t influence the outcome then he is tactically astute / naive accordingly. The difference is that we as fans and the media have the benefit of adding ‘hindsight’ into the mix and therefore you (the fan) have the benefit of an argument either way, managers don’t have such a luxury, they have to make’ judgements’.
Scene 5 ‘Why didst thy forsake a fellow to the outreaches of the seaside colony, leaving us bereft of options?’– now let’s be honest here, I like O’hara, I think he still has a bright future ahead of him, but in order to achieve that he needed to play 1st team games regularly in order to improve. Was he going to get ahead of Hudd and Wilson? Well no, you could even argue he wasn’t at the time ahead of Jenas in the pecking order, add to that we didn’t need the same squad size as we haven’t been involved in European football this season. So what do you do? Get him somewhere to get games for a season and bring him back when you need him the following season when European football is back on the table? Plus in Modric and Krancjar you have two players who have the ability to play central mid. So all in all it made sense to me to have loaned him out and it still does to be honest.
Scene 6 ‘I demand my pounds, messers three’ – And so we have the pending court cases for Redknapp, Storrie and Mandaric, where of course there is ‘no smoke without fire’, isn’t there? It is difficult one to argue against because as much as we’d like to think that the law of our great nation is ‘innocent until proven guilty’, the fact is that the media have replaced this requirement with its own ‘opinions’ on the matter. It’s also difficult to defend because on the face of it someone must be guilty even if of incompetence between the three of them.
And even if cleared, it’s the one thing that will never go away, Harry started his management career in an era when the ‘day of the brown envelope’ probably (or perhaps ‘possibly’ for legal reasons) did exist. So regardless of the outcome of the result of the court case it will forever follow him around and consequently there are those that will (perhaps illogically considering the nature of our own Dear Mr Levy) suggest that current transfers and other aspects of his management (other than winning) are related to pure financial gain.
Scene 7 ‘My kingdom for a seat’– So Harry doesn’t stand up sometime. Is this not simply a case of reading too much ‘context’ into situations, have we started believing what we read, in the press and also indeed on blogs, as to what his reaction to anything in particular means? With analysing everything to the Nth degree there’s always a danger of bias by any one person (I’m aware of the fact that it also includes me). Not sure here on this particular facet, maybe one of his lackies (see below) is there to do that for him.
Scene 8 ‘You sir, surround yourself with nomads and vagabonds’ – ‘Jobs for the boys’? Well, err yes it would appear so, but on the evidence so far they aren’t doing too shabby a job. OK we don’t have to like them, but if they can improve the players then that’s surely all they have to do. I, like many others, would rather have Lineker working with Defoe than Ferdinand, but then again as Defoe is already on 17 goals for the season in the league maybe I shouldn’t complain too much.
Scene 9 ‘Why dist thou appear in those ‘Wii’ adverts?’ – yeah, well, I can’t defend the un-defendable really can I?
Act 3 - Epilogue (much ado about nothing)
NB. This is the bit you can ignore and go straight to comment as it is only my opinion.
A fellow spurs acquaintance of mine refers to Harry as ‘limited’ and I would not disagree. He does have his limitations and, for me, is not the long term future for THFC, as he will not be around long term (5 - 10 years) to build up a squad. We already know this because Harry’s not getting any younger and he already has his retirement home on Sandbanks with the kids and grandchildren nearby, and his Wii of course. So if he passes it over to the next ‘caretaker’ with a more balanced squad and in better shape than when he arrived then that’s fine by me and thanks for the memories.
However, it should be recognised that Harry has been and continues to be ‘fit for purpose’, coming off the back of a period whereby stability was what was required by the club. He has more than adequately provided that basis for improvement. His record in both the league and Cups stacks up well since arriving, if anything he has got a bit lucky on a few occasions as consequently has perhaps over-performed. But as one of many adages goes ‘sometimes in football you don’t have to be a good manager, just a lucky one.
The problem he will have to face now is dealing with an elevated sense of ‘expectation’ of ‘us' the fans and financiers of THFC. Our team are currently 4th in the league and in the semi of the FA cup. Do I think we will win the cup and finish in our current position? Well this has already been well covered, and so I have to stick with my previous position, no I can see us getting to the final and losing and then finishing 5th or 6th, but would dearly love to be proven wrong.
So what if we do finish without any cup, but do get European football next season with a top 6 finish? Well, I for one would have taken that at the start of the season, and so the benefit of ‘time’ and ‘hindsight’ strikes again it would seem...
Reader Comments (54)
The fact you informed us that TAB+ALT switches between pages was pretty much the only thing that made this article worth reading
Good solid article, needed to be said even if its stating the obvious.
Some Spurs fans are still critical of Redknapp. Can;t figure then out. he has worked a miracle when all that was needed was some old fashion back to basics football management.
More ignorant Rebrov bashing
Rebrov/Pavyluchenko/ = Hoddle/Redknapp = Keane/Sheringham
u knob
I think you should have stopped after the comment:
"P82 W44 D18 L20 with a win %age that currently puts him 3rd on the list of spurs all time managers"
Truly outstanding record considering he picked up a team in the relegation zone. How can anyone question that, even if we do finish 5th and lose the final, do you seriously think there is anyone who could/would have come to Spurs and done a better Job?!?
Get behind the man, he's been a revelation!
Spooky, for the first time I can safely say you bored the hell out of me, Oh wait......It wasn't Spooky! Thank God for that.
anon... Is that the Shrodinger's Cat theorem or have you missed a + or a - out of your equation somewhere? It's complete gibberish and are you Davspurs in disguise?
Good stuff. Sadly I agree with you that we will probably get to the final and lose and end up finishing 5th in the league. Dropping points at home against Stoke and Wolves will probably cost us the champions league spot. Hope I am wrong as winning the cup and getting into champions league would be dreamland.
p.s Rafa is a knob. As someone has just brilliantly pointed out on the web, Harry should take his ramblings on the Liverpool website, print them out and stick them on the dressing room wall at the weekend.
Was pleasantly surprised when ol' Arry was drafted in to repair the debacle of Ramos..BUT I never pegged him as someone who could take us forward, to where we wanted to be.
But do you know what? I think the fella deserves (whatever happens now) all the time he wants.
He's turned potential into consistency in a lot of players, he's able to get players who are not match fit to play out of position and still get the job done. Amazing really, never knew he had it in him.
And fuck it, if he goes down he can run the club from his cell, Joe Jordan can smuggle in the meat and cheeses and Kevin can slice the garlic with his razor blade.
Arry has actually bought a bit of respect back to our club and it could be party time! Now is the Winter of our Disco Tent! COYS!
Anon - Rebrov was fucking rubbish, completely over rated.
Toppsy, harsh.
Appointing Harry was a masterstroke. Not something I agreed with at the time but nobody but a fool could possibly argue against it now.
Back to basics.
bit disappointed with this article - nothing that didnt naturally occur to me or most probably 99% of all other spurs fans...sorry but wasnt brilliant today.
everyone's a critic!
ITS TYPICAL OF SPURS FANS, I LIVE IN THE NORTH OF ENGLAND AND GET TO SEE SPURS AWAY A LOT AND HOME AROUND 6 TIMES A SEASON. THIS IS THE BEST SPURS SIDE FOR A LONG TIME, A PLEASURE TO WATCH AND SUPPORT MOST OF THE TIME. I RECENTLY HAD AN ARGUMENT WITH A FELLOW SPURS FAN AT THE WIGAN AWAY GAME, WHO INSISTED HARRY SHOULD BE SACKED, FOR WHAT REASON HE COULDNT GIVE, I POINTED OUT OUR FORM OUR STYLE OF PLAY AND THE FACT WE WERE IMPROVING AND THE FUTURE LOOKED GOOD UNDER HARRY AND THE SQUAD OF PLAYERS. HE WAS A SEASON TICKET HOLDER AND SPENT THE GAME SLAGGING OFF CORLUKA DAWSON CROUCH ETC AND OF COURSE HARRY, I WONDER WHY HE BOUGHT A SEASON TICKET, I WANT EVERYONE TO GET BEHIND THE TEAM NOT SLAG THEM WERE PLAYING WELL AND HAVE HAD A GREAT SEASON I HOPE THE IDIOTS STAY AWAY AND FOLLOW THE SPAMMERS NOW THEY HAVE PROBLEMS.
Called me old fashioned but it is "art thou..." not "is thou..." Your "Thou ist" is positively German it is "thou art". Still that apart I thought the article fair enough, though I don't have a particular issue with our manager's prattlings in the press. When we get fourth we won't care.
There is only one man and his team I would rather have and we can't afford him. Besides Harry Hotspur, Harry Redknapp coincidence I think not :)
Stop giving TAB+ALT air time.
Anyone got any FA cup semi final tickets for sale?
Sure. £800, you can have mine.
You can have mine for a nosh
This article is incomplete: you forgot to condemn him for his droopy jowls and his twitch.
shite article stopped reading, not funny nor smart, harry is god come on you spurs
On the tax thing, you'd have to be pretty stupid to risk a conviction on the back of dodging a mere 40K given what a PL manager earns, so to think Redknapp and co. carried out something malicious rather than just dozy or irresponsible just doesn't seem likely unless I'm grossly misreading the situation. So even if he's found guilty I'd expect a hefty fine and a slap rather than a stretch avoiding picking up the soap (not that I'm in any way knowledgable about legalistics).
Looking back to expectations at the start of the season, I'm pretty amazed with being where we are. I still think Liverpool's run-in is far too cushy compared to ours (we will finish 5th) and the prospect of Chelski at Wembley either chasing the Double or on the back of Title disappointment seems pretty grim. We've got the talent, I just question the mental fortitude and experience of being under this sort of expectation.
I thought this was Spooky having an off day, thankfully not in which case pick your guests carefully, bloody boring waste of my life...back Arry...simple
Needed to be said. I know one or two people who spout bollocks about the manager all the time no obvious clear reason why other than perhaps his West Ham connections and the ambiguity of his alleged financial dealings. Article doesnt say anything I dont know already but enjoyed it and will pass onto the idiots who still claim Harry is not the right person for the job.
And yes - short term right person for the job. Hope to see him take us up to the next level, consolidate our place there and then have a younger man come in to take over and continue the progress.
Personally, I think the guest bloggers get less abuse than I do, which is ace in my book.
I'm actually disappointed by that, I'm guessing some are just being 'politely discontented'.
All I would say is that to those that 'this is obvious', or support harry anyway, yes, it probably should go without saying.
But there are still plenty of haters out there, who it would appear are perhaps now conspicuous in their absence. Lost their voice a little perhaps?
and 'ctrl alt delete' you are still the daddy of the short cuts.
Bring on the haters!
Well thought out and presented Tricky. I've had reservations about Harry, he's all about number one but then so are one or two other managers out there and if it benefits THFC then who cares? I know I don't. Not now.
All these Booker-winning raconteurs criticising this article should have a go at writing something themselves, or fuck off back to Mensa HQ (Harry Dronespur).
Pay them exactly the attention they deserve Tricky, you made me laugh a couple of times, so keep it up.
Redknapp has been class since arriving at Spurs. We need a Manager in charge for years and things will only get better. Surely Spurs have finally realised that a quick fix doesn't work. Harry is the man and I hope he is our boss for years to come. This is the best football we have seen for many years at Tottenham! I can't believe he's only lost 20 games out of 82! Long may that continue.
There can't be any argument that Harry isn't doing a fantastic job,
COYS.
Good read , allebeit a tad bit on the long side :-)
I do not need to go in to it deeper 'cause Jep said exactly what i wanted to say.
I never wanted Redknapp, however we now have the best team, squad and league position since before the premier league started. The man deserves a medal, get off his back all you doubters, get behind the team. COYS.
I think his critics just start from their dislike of him and work out their arguments to back that up from there. As a Spurs fan I start from what he has done for my club. Add up all the points and the goals and you will see he has done a great job.
So to like Harry as a Spurs fan you just have to be able to add up. If the success of Spurs is not such a big deal for others then they should go support WHU instead instead of talking nonsense about our successful manager.
Well said spooky-i'm right behind you about this one.
I am Bulgarian,no big deal but 4th place funny enough was our best in 1994 World Cup and was a similarity about this spot-the 4th.We did have a great players-Stoichkov,Balakov,Letchkov,Penev etc.,and we shake ''up side down'' your beloved Germany in last 16 2:1...oh what a night.Our manager was Dimitar Penev who is uncle of the player Luboslav Penev who manage to score first in la liga as a foreigner over 100 goals with 3 diferent clubs.Like Arry,Dimitar Penev was peace of art-hardly speaking his own language(like me english),full of non-sence,wear a flip-flops on the oficial calendar of the national team for summer 1994...But as lucky as pig around the christmas in my countrey-it was him making our best ever -not only in past i guess place in a world cup.Ever since we didnt make much after that 4h place and its not looking likely having now M.Petrov,S.Petrov,Berbatov and a few more good ones.
I hope i can see were you coming from and writing here this sample i'm only hope every one can make the same as me-imagine Arry at spurs without player he gets 's and bring after and money to spend...it's not that hard to follow his record at west championship ham and admin pompey...
I can not miss to be greatful for lifting as from bottom to were we are,i can not underarest his work with low confidence players and turning them around-smile-a big one,i can not forget to ask my self if Martin Jol was re-united after Juan Ramos-what was the odds to be same as Arry or even better,i can not forget players like Pav,Gio,Adel who simpley dont fit the bill whats happend to them as motivation..Arry put them in the 'acking reserve team' without even 'itin 'im with ball over a Wee advert:)))))))
Looking good as 2010 almost FA finalist and no that far from final 4th in the table.Hope we got the money to keep on Arry project and dont go agains Tax man...and full of confidence when i'm saying-with Arry there is no future.it will be what is it now atmost or a bit less.To me-Fulham as club and player and Arry sound more likely,sure the other way around-Us with Roy Hodgson or may be less experience one-David Moyes able to beat top sides and work with future.Arry-simply no thank you:))))
Feel welcome to go over me now-remember-only the time will show all answers.We think we know everything-the people who may know something like to say ''i'm happy to know that I dont know anything about anything''
Its been 31 years for me,it will be more or less another 31 with Spurs in my heart-so COYS!!!
Fact 1.. Harry is the BEST English manager in the League
Fact 2.. Our defensive record this season has been exceptional behind only Chelsea and Man U
Fact 3.. Our points total at this stage has been the highest since the inception of the Premier League
Fact 4.. Compared to Fergie, he is 6 years younger.. so he has at least 5 years of management left in him
Draw your own conclusions. He IS the best manager we have had in 20 odd years.. with his luck, I am betting that we may just nick the Cup and 4th..
Yeah , Tricky's shit.
I need to make sure the articles are written by Spooky before I read them as that was pointless.
he's exceeded my expectations massively. when we got him I thought, great, we'll survive relegation and go back to mid-table again. But what a job he's done. He inherited good players low on confidence and has made them resolute, hard to beat and full of goals. In less than 2 full seasons. It's taken O'neill and Moyes longer to get to that point and they are now below us. If we are to push on again next season he simply MUST stay. end of. Well done Harry.
If your not gonna back your team then go away No one wants to hear your negativity when we're going for Champions league and FA cup success
I think Harry has been the right solution for the right time. He has us believing whether we like to admit it or not. He has the players believing - something we desperately needed. He has Levy believing - can only be good for the club, and it also means we will have some sort of stability in the managerial position... for now.
Got about a third of the way down and thought, 'somethings wrong here'. Went back to top. Checked again. Ah there it is, guest blogger. Thought the end of my (virtually) daily entertainment was over!!
Note to self. Check who wrote article first as I will not get that time back, ever.
I liked the post, Tricky, not sure why you're getting abuse for it, it's only a bloody blog post. I also liked the Prose before hos pic... ahem.
I couldn't have been more shocked when we signed Harry, the speed of it all surprised the hell out of me, not to mention that he wasn't too pleased with our fans slagging off Judas just before he came from Pompey to us, remember that?
Anyway, the guy still makes a few decisions that confuse me but they only annoy me when they don't pay dividends. When they work they're magic. Over all there's no denying he's worked wonders and long may it continue. Arry's triffic.
Harry is doing a great job the only two things he is weak on the media and subs and lady luck is helping him by injuring players and forcing him to think quickly this should help him in future and help him make better decisions. He has kept us in fourth and there abouts all season with many set backs through injury and the one major thing that has come out of this injury crisis is the emergence of our squad Captain Dawson has thrown the shadow of King off his back and Woodgate . Secondly Lennons injury has bean tempered by the blossoming Bale so cruelly cut short by bad tackles and injuries to is ankle in his teen'.s Butt now aged just twenty he is looking like the next super star on our incredible assembly line and love or hate Them Levey and Commoli' s legacy is baring fruit and Spurs Fans are in for one helluva season and yes you need luck and with what i have been telling you all season about Dodge Tempo plenty of it and when Harry retires we have Jamie and Louise now they would look good on the bench. Tricky have more faith its part of being a spurs fan and why i fell in love with a place 4 hours away from my home . This will settle you nerves we will finish fourth by four points from city and Liverpool on 64 we will be on 68 points we will Beat Aston villa 3- 1 and next year you will need to read my book the North West cockerel Killed the Liver Bird, To see what happens in another exciting season .COYS
Can I pre-order that book on Amazon Dav?
I like the structure and its well put together, well written. Bit long ,otherwise interesting.
I'm another Harry convert. I think that he and the team have developed together and Harry is showing more tactical nous than previously. As someone has said he has been forced into be being cleverer and bolder by the situation.
I don't go along with this idea that to question the manager,or Levy, or even the performance and attitude of the players is being disloyal.
We are only talking amongst ourselves after all. It doesn't actually affect what happens on the field
.
Otherwise you might as well scrap all the fansites and have a' Homage to Harry site' which would be very very boring .We've got the Official Site for all that kind of thing.
in arry I trust. Well done mr Redknapp, please keep it going.
COYS.
CANADA YID MY BOOK WONT BE ON AMAZON ITS TO RAUNCHY AND WILL BE PRINTED BY DWARF PUBLISHERS . SULLIVAN AND GOLD if my predictions come true you will get a copy with good punctuation and full stops
2pf8g...?
Two Points from eight games.