Open letter to Daniel Levy
Tuesday, January 25, 2011 at 9:40AM Morning.
You'll have seen Daniel Levy on Sky Sports News (special) yesterday evening, and probably found yourself struggling with the apparent sudden transparency he was offering in terms of Stratford and N17. The Northumberland Development Project is no longer viable. And if we fail with our bid to win the Olympic Site then Levy will look at other options - outside of Tottenham meaning that we are leaving White Hart Lane no matter what.
I'm sort of hoping this is a bluff, one final monumental bluff although quite how you can force Haringey and an angry Lammy to react to this in a favourable way is beyond me. Mainly because the fragmentation between local council and the club has created a 'us and them' name calling culture of blame. We'll skip around the politics relating to monies and funds ('broke' local council) and instead concentrate on what Levy told us in his interview.
Not a lot when you start asking questions. It was fairly blunt, I'm sure you'd agree.
Woke up this morning with the intention of writing him an open letter only to find that someone else has done the job perfectly and for anyone wondering why many of us are still searching for that fabled transparency - then click on the below, read the letter then scratch your head a little more.
Last night was not transparent in terms of understanding why remaining in North London is suddenly impossible.
To read the open letter by Martin Cloake click here.
Considering Daniel loves his inbox, let's hope he takes the time to read and reply to one that isn't quite patting him on the back.
Reader Comments (129)
Mes, only a 100% united front would ever be effective. The majority is silent and ambivolent, it is the english way.
Life is comprimise and rationalisation (sometimes of the irrational) for the vast majority of us in one form or another, so some of us sit back watch it unfold, and wait for the cycle to complete and it all to turn to rat shit.
Unfortunately the support for not moving isn't there amongst the fans, if Spurs were to ask season ticket holders only about this then we'd stay at WHL but we're a global brand & i'd guess that anywhere upto 75% of spurs 'fans' have never even been to the lane.
Levy & the board don't care about the hardcore fans who are there every week because they know they'll fill the new stadium with the prawn sandwich brigade. Money is money & they don't care how they get it.
It’s the first time in my life I have wanted the Pickeys to win anything, they can have the ground, but it seems Levy is set on moving at any cost. Mercenaries, that’s what the club has as a board and by the sound of it, we have got some as fans as well! The corporate bullshit about sixty thousand seater stadium full of supporters all loyal to the club. What club? Stratford Spurs or perhaps some snazzy yank name like East London Nomads! Mark you say N17 group is holding back the club, Tottenham is the club. I don't want to see a victory parade around East London if we ever by some miracle won the league. I want to see the bus go past the Bell and Hare whilst I am having a victory pint. If we don't win it ever again, so be it, at least we have not sold our soul. Harry has done a fantastic job as manager but loyalty and tradition are not high on his agenda (ask Pompey fans), so when he say's "the club have to move on" yes Harry like to the England job? Don't believe the hype, the only people who really care about THFC are the fans, players, managers and the board come and go. N17 group are fighting for our heritage, Bill Nic will be turning in his grave. Make sure you mercenaries never sing "We are Tottenham from the Lane" ever again.
My sentiments exactly, Bill P. Well said.
People are getting excited about UEFA's new rules and whether we can hold on to players without moving:
I say fuck all that. Having a football club is much more important than any of that.
I blame robbe keane.
Me too.
The clue is in our name - TOTTENHAM Hotspur, Mr Levy.
The open letter makes some excellent points which we deserve to hear (i) why is NDP now unviable, what has changed and (ii) let's see the numbers. The last question about selling up is irrelevent and would never be answered anyway.
Oh get a grip if you seriously think that if we get the go ahead to take over the olympic stadium that in 4 years time the costs havent spiralled up to and way past the current quoted costs of NDP. If they are quoting costs of 200-250million now then in 2016 when they view a new stadium opening there it will be well past 400m as history shows with all of these stadiums. So dont kid yourself we are not going to be without huge debts, cos we will and also we have a current waiting list of 35,000 for season tickets and the whole model is built around this figure to create 60,000 seater stadium but how many of those fans will still want to watch stratford spurs? Or are you all hoping to pick up ex spammers fans???
Yidal, top man, well said someone with passion for the soul of the club. All those who want a super club, watch how soon Man City fans get bored after winning their first trophy that was brought for them by the Arabs.
Bill P, great sentiment and one shared by an awful lot of people. One which, if you asked most fans outright they would say they agree with - Those who have been to the ground and who have enjoyed the atmosphere at least. One thing is for certain however and that is going back to the way things were or us simply staying put is not going to happen, so we have to get that out of our heads.
For what its worth, I also think that the aggressive line taken by much of the anti movement has alienated a lot of people who were undecided either way. To say that anyone who isn't a card-carrying member of the movement is a mercenary and try to illicit shame is akin to Bush's "Y'awl with us or agin us" pre-gulf rhetoric. There are 35,000 people that cram into that little box every second week and scream their heads off... 33,000 of them are not mercenaries.
All I am saying (repeatedly) is that we have to be better at communicating messages to people than simply arguing amongst each other and condemning anyone who doesn't sing the battle hymn. There are hundreds of thousands of Spurs fans around the world. Failure to connect with them is failure on our part if, as you rightly say, the supporters are the lifeblood of the club.
Also that we will build the stadiun in OP and NOT ACTUALY OWN IT!! So we have to pay rent to play in our own stadium.
the 10% sell out Stratford fans have their head up levy's arse believing everything he says. I feel myself more and more thinking if we move then I will fall out of love with Football. Maybe I would follow the FC Hotspur of Tottenham. Its pretty amazing where AFC Wimbledon are now.
There are a lot of comments from season ticket holders on these forums about staying in WHL rather than moving to a larger stadium, (let me add in that I appreciate the value season ticket holders bring to our club, money, vocal support etc) but is it really fair for the people who are guaranteed to get tickets to watch their beloved spurs each and every week to deny ~30,000 people who are desperate to have a chance to get season tickets. It cost me £45 a year to just stay on the waiting list, ok I also get a cheap DVD, and the privilege of being able to book tickets earlier than joe public - great. There are plently like me desperate to get hold of a season ticket, and currently there are just over 5,000 people ahead of me in the queue, this rarely changes year by year. It'll be a long wait till I get a chance. What about tomorrows fans, currently if you decide to join the queue you be number 30,000 odd. If we stick in our current stadium you could be waiting well over 30 years to get hold of a season ticket. So for all those who have season tickets spare a moment to think of those without, yes we appreciate the historical and sentimental points, and would prefer to stay in N17, but i would be nice to be able to give more a chance.
Levy has been lying all along, the NDP was NEVER a goer and I for one always thought that the project price was ridiculously high, why not scale the costs down Daniel. As far as conspircies go, I believe that Levy always wanted the Olympic Stadium and used the costs of the NDP to justify moving, once w're out of WHL we'll be sold.
Fuck off Levy we're a North London Club, the only one and always should be.
One word: Referendum.
The NPD became a non goer when the final plans were only accepted with a 52k seater stadium, with no future expansion. is 450million worth it when we are only going to get an extra 16k. Stratford is starting with a 60k capacity which can then be expanded to 90k. ok its only 8k seats. But if those 8k seats are £50 a pop that equates to about 10million a year in lost revenue if we have about 24 home games. Also the ridiculous demands of the local council. Wanting us to pay for new roads, street signs etc. We applied to build 400 flats. Get told we can only have 200. 200 hundred flats at 200k each is £40million. So over say the first 5 years of being there. That would be almost 100million lost from original projections of repaying the money back. LITTLE details like that make it not as attractive to stay. What gets me is though is how everyone is insistent that Levy and Co want to sell. There hasn't even been rumours of some1 wanting to buy the club. Levy has done a wonderful job. He wants to spend big on a striker in this window its Harry that don't. I don't understand why the N17 group feel that Levy and Co should spend £200million more and risk the future of the club to stay in tottenham. To them its white hart lane or nowhere. These would be the same people who would stop going when the cheapest ticket becomes £60 to try and pay off the massive debt. And up in arms when we sell Bale for £80million and none of it gets put back into the team. Every1 needs to get real. Do we support The players or the stadium. Do none of you go to away games. You all want a trip to wembley. Its the same thing. The players and club we support playing on a different pitch.
Are we going to fill a 60K stadium at home against the likes of Wigan?
Talking of sexism, my girlfriends 'Deep pore cleanser' - the one she left next to the sink this morning -
looks just like toothpaste, however, tastes just like shit! It's been hours since the argument but saliva keeps filling up my mouth....I'm terrified - do I spit or do I swallow - I feel like a fucking douge de bordeaux.
CALM DOWN CALM DOWN!!
People are getting too far ahead of themselves. While Stratford maybe the cheapest option, we are effectively in the middle of a negotiation with Haringey.
If we came out half way through the process and said….”NDP is viable but we want to save money and Stratford will do that” then we undermine our whole position with everyone….the Olympic Legacy Committee, the Council, the fans.
Levy has to maintain a “non-viable” stance otherwise everyone will question the OS bid.
Also, he is now throwing “we will move anyway” in to the ring. This does 2 things – Firstly it says to haringey…this is not simply about moving to the OS becuase its cheaper and better accessed, its about moving because it is not viable at WHL.
It is also saying to everyone, we need to extend, WHL is not a viable site, the Olympic site is, but even if that fails we will look elsewhere….so whether its Enfield or another nearby Borough, Haringey & Lammy beware that simply undermining the only current credible option does not make the problem go away, and does not guarantee we will stay at WHL forever.
Levy is a very clever negotiator. The things he is saying now is simply setting out our negotiation stance. DO NOT CONFUSE NEGOTIATIONS WITH FACTS!! …anyone who plays poker will know you play your opponents, not your hand. A bit of bluffing is necessary from time to time. If Spurs win the OS bid then they will have the strongest hand and Haringey/Lammy will have to help us or lose us…..even if we fail to win the OS bid, they may lose us anyway, so Lammy et al, quit undermining us and help us!
Everything needs to be done in the right order. If we win the bid, we can genuinely say to Haringey, BACK US OR LOSE US....we would be foolish to have a fans survey that said 70% of fans don;t want to go as that would only add strength to Haringeys position. Negotiations need to be concluded first before we undertake and publish surveys of support/objection...otherwise we will be undermining our own position.
All this paranioa about Legy wanting to sell....firstly he & ENIC have served us brilliantly over the years. Secondly if he want to sell us then fair enough, thats his right. We cannot control that, unless you go out there and spend millions of shares.
People talk shite when they say 30000 on the waiting list. Im on and have been since I let go of my season ticket a few years ago. I buy it to get the extra day in order to get a ticket, then I hope if the day ever comes when I get offered one, that I have a spare 1k lying around.
I rekon of you offered all 30000 a season ticket we would sell half max.
Are we going to fill a 60K stadium at home against the likes of Wigan?
- - - -
We fill a 36k vs Wigan.
35k on the ST waiting list.
I am sure we would sell another 20,000 ST with a new stadium so most games would be 55-60k attendances
@devonshirespur
It could all be a bluff but Im not prepared to stay silent and take this chance.
At the very least Levy could come out and tell us what exactly the council would need to change to make it viable.
Put a list of demands down in public and let the council answer publicly.
He wants to destroy nearly 130 years of history. Levy out.
I rekon of you offered all 30000 a season ticket we would sell half max.
- - - - -
So of the new capacity of 23500 addition seats - 15000 new season ticket holders, 5k-8k bronze members/general and say utp to 2,500 additional away support for big games
I just added my newly born son to the bronze season ticket waiting list, cost a fiver so I thought I may as well get him on there with me, even though I am 27,000, not that I am pushing him or anything like that. he can chose whoever he wants to support as long as they play in white and have a cockerel badge, so i'll leave that with him to chose.
anyway, my point is the 30,000 waiting list is now, wait for it 42k..
Season Ticket Waiting List. - Position on list: 42675
as people have said, not all people actually want one, it gives you a day ahead to buy tickets, not that that helped me when i tried to buy arsenal tickets as the 'bronze allocation' sold out (good one club).
but anyway 42k gives Levy plenty of armoury..
Robby Boy, you're not Robbie Keane are you? Come on, has it come to this? Just accept the Birmingham deal, please!?
Levy's riding in on his great lilywhite steed to save the day (and the public's money):
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23917210-why-we-should-be-backing-spurs-for-the-olympics.do?
@ yidal.
No offence mate that is not how negotiations work. We don't want to run this in the media, lets leave all the gobshite soundbites to West Ham & Brady.
If your problem is that we are even considering leaving WHL/N17 then you will never be appeased.
If you are open minded, then you have to see the big picture and trust in the board. Utlimately the options are:
1. Do nothing
2. Expand WHL
3. Rebuild WHL
4. Move (Stratford, Enfield, Pickets Lock?)
If we do 1. then we will never compete with the big boys and will stgnate.
If we do 2. it will be expensive and will only increase capacity a small amout, and will still need to pay for improved public transport etc
Option 3 is expensive, may financially cripple us but is most peoples preferred choice IF AFFORDABLE. If it is not affordable then of the remaining options (1, 2 & 4), 4 is the only one that will take the club forward.
What options do you see? what should we do?
Also, Barry Hearn's had a nice little meeting this morning with the OPLC... looks like Wet Spam are firmly in his crosshairs!
I can live with a move as long as its North London so as far as enfield I would accept. So I am not against considering other options but anywhere out of North East London and away from our roots is not acceptable.
Id happily live with an expanded WHL too. Id happily do nothing for the time being while other options in the NE area are looked at.
I dont see how 'being open minded' should mean trusting the board, that's a pretty ridiculous statement.
It is also not right to intimate that someone is 'narrow minded' because they want to stay in North London.
@ Yidal
I can live with a move as long as its North London so as far as enfield I would accept. So I am not against considering other options but anywhere out of North East London and away from our roots is not acceptable.
Id happily live with an expanded WHL too. Id happily do nothing for the time being while other options in the NE area are looked at.
I dont see how 'being open minded' should mean trusting the board, that's a pretty ridiculous statement.
It is also not right to intimate that someone is 'narrow minded' because they want to stay in North London.
- - - - - - - -
Our roots are not Enfield, our roots are Tottenham High Road, London Borough of Haringey. We sing about Paxton Road, White Hart Lane, Park Lane, the Shelf. Enfield has an EN postcode, its a different Borough....all of this changes just as it does in Stratford.
If we move out of Tottenham, even by just 500m, then what is the difference.
You want us to stay where our roots are but will accept moving to Enfield.....'narrow minded' you are not, confused definitely.
My comments regarding "Trusting the Board" are simply that you should not take everything said at face value. Levy is trying to put us in the best position, keeping all options open, giving us the best chance or securing the best outcome for THFC
Just because he says NDP is not viable does not mean it is true, or that we HAVE TO leave WHL/Tottenham to expand.....thats is what I mean by looking at the big picture and keeping an open mind!
So what you are saying Yidal is that as long as the postcode has an N in it, such as N9 or EN, then that's ok but if it's an E postcode it's not acceptable?
What about poor old Tottenham, Lammy and the LB of Haringey when we move to the LB of Enfield? What about "weareN17"? What about all those other arguments referring to the history and tradition of Tottenham, WHL and so on...
So the real issue is not about moving, the issue is about leaving North London and moving 5-6 miles East... i'm sorry but this whole argument is becoming weaker by the day and my fence sitting has me beginning to fall off into the garden where the sun rises, sorry mate.
Got a really poignant, beautifully crafted guest blog on all this, slightly less sledgehammer approach to some of my recent raging ranting.
Won't make it live till tomorrow though.
I posted this on the Sasha Grey entry but everyone seems to have moved on, so permit me the duplication with a few addendums:
I am not going to pretend to know the ins and outs of the NDP vs. the OS. I live in the states but I've been following it as best I can.
I have a few questions though:
Is Levy's proposal really to completely demolish the OS and build a brand new stadium?
If yes, how can that be cheaper than building one right next to WHL? I can see modifying a stadium, pulling up the track etc, but to nuke it and start over?
That seems insane to me.
And why would the local government (i.e. Haringey) get in the way of building a new stadium? How can that not be good for local commerce and economics? Seems like a no brainer. Bigger stadium, more folks in the area, more folks in the local pubs pre and post game, more folks having dinner out etc.
Am I being too logical?
Last question, from what I can gather some historical buildings got in the way of the first set of plans. There has been a lot of sarcasm about this. Are they really just run down crap?
I've never been to WHL except by satellite through my tv, but I understand the importance of place, history, and tradition. I get chills when I hear the place rocking. So I say N17. Never been there, but it feels like it rests right in my left chest under my ribs.
Who wrote it? You should ask that 'desktop' bloke to write one.
The Paperclip?
He's starting to look more like Crouch each time he suggests he helps me do something.
Not someone who has guest blogged before, but hoping he will in future too. Spurs fan living in Leeds, former Shelfer, know him from another (non football related) forum. He wrote something up on the back of all the emotional head fucking going on.
Looking forward to sharing it.
Andy Gray sacked by Sky for offensive behaviour
oh youuu beaautty
Take a day off son, take a day off.
We might be needing this soon:
http://www.londonbrownfieldsites.org/Mapping/
Diary entry for Saturday, 24th January, 2111
Today I took my son Trilogy to see his first football game at Stratford Olympians. We were up against the current English, European and World Club Champions, the mighty Vauxhall Motors. Being only seven years-old, young Trilogy was a little intimidated by the pre-match entertainment – especially the flying-saucer fly-past and the grey alien cheerleaders with their huge, obsidian eyes. But the holographic projection into the centre-circle of the Chairman’s benign face for the delivery of his traditional, rousing oratory cheered him up immensely.
Then onto the match itself, and Stratford played like true Olympians. They cut through Motors like organic butter and, thirty minutes into the first half, we were already 3-0 up. Then the crowd (as it does every game) began singing, “We are Tottenham, super Tottenham from the Lane,” and I (as I do every game) joined in. The home support was as one: “We are Tottenham, super Tottenham from the Lane.”
“Daddy, daddy!” enquired young Trilogy with a confused grimace, “What does it mean? Why is everybody singing ‘We are Tottenham, super Tottenham from the Lane’? What is ‘Tottenham’ and where is ‘the Lane’?” And it occurred to me that I had absolutely no idea. It was just something I sang along with 59,999 others every time we go to Beijing Lantern Stadium to watch the team play. It’s probably not much different to how people use certain everyday phrases and sayings, such as ‘the bitter end’ or ‘at one fell swoop’. We say these things, but we have no idea where they come from or why we say them. Well, that doesn’t normally matter – until your seven year-old child asks you about them and you feel a complete fool for being unable to provide him with a proper answer.
Hence, after the game – which Olympians finally won 5-0! – I decided to do a little research and, on the air-bus home to Baffin Bay, I activated the i-Button on the back of my skull and switched the setting to ‘Enquire’ – and, after some inconsequential pages, I discovered that, up until about 100 years ago, Stratford Olympians was called ‘Tottenham Hotspur’, and the club played at a stadium known as ‘White Hart Lane’ – foreshortened colloquially to ‘The Lane’. I was amazed. Apparently, the club had relocated lock, stock and barrel from an area of North London formerly known as Tottenham (which is now just the capital’s land-fill site) to its current location.
It was certainly a relief to find an adequate response to Trilogy’s questions – after all, no father wants to be found wanting by his children; but I must admit I’m left rather puzzled by this new information. I realise that life was different in the past and that civilisation has come a long way, but I don’t understand how a century ago it was possible to move an entire football club five miles across London. Perhaps the technology at that time was far more advanced than we think. Oh, well, Trilogy doesn’t seem too concerned about that, and tells me he can’t wait to go to the next home game at the Lantern. Of course, that all depends on the opening of the new sulphur mine on Mars going well and me getting back on time.
At any rate, one thing’s for sure – Trilogy is now officially a Stratford Olympians supporter, just like his dad.
@DY
What argument then, go on you sum up all of my points made during this long debate. I have never said I want us to move out of Tottenham, that said I am prepared to listen to other options in the areas considered Tottenham territory if the NDP doesnt happen.
I think your being a little padantic and trying to make the argument black and white - it all means different things to different people.
I still think it would be heartbreaking to leave Tottenham with the NDP but if given the option of towards enfield way or stratford then...
Its not about postcodes (dont be silly), We are n17 is a slogan, you will have to ask their definition of what it means and if they are totaly against anything other than n17 or if they will consider other areas in what is considered our territory.
I don't consider myself definitively in one camp but if there is a spectrum then Im still a million miles away from being a stratscum.
I dont care what fence you are on or how long you sit there, or if you fall off anytime.
There is no weakness to my argument - its my point, my opionion and what I care about. It's what Tottenham mean to me. Sorry mate.
Anyone here read Harry Hotspurs blog? Seems to be having a go at you there Spooky today. Does he sit on the fence with Stratford because he hardly makes it clear from one day to the next. Find most sites to be either for or against.
AnywaysDon't think we'll be awarded the OS so it hardly matters to me. Also think Levy is bluffing. Can't see us leaving.
spooky, These are sad times. Tottenham Hotspur FC is no longer to be. You have to look at who is involved in the spurs bid and take note of AEG. AEG is a big and powerful organisation, and they get what they want. Take a look at AEG's track record where they aquire sports clubs. They uproot sports clubs then re-brand them, new name, new badge, new kit (including new colours). This is what is going to happen to THFC.
Watching recent events, I believe D Levy has already sold our club in principle to AEG and is now engineering the move away from WHL. The development of a new stadium at WHL was never going to happen and I along with many others fell for it. Long Li ve TOTTENHAM & WHITE HART LANE................FOREVER IN MY HEART.
Very Ballardian, nine thirty sev.., I mean Desktop. ;-)
You like a bit of Desktop do you?
Love him!
Evening standard reckons west ham are In pole position and the delay is down to extended review of their finances. Fingers crossed eh.
Brilliant ITK info there. I'm down the bookies first thing.
Apparently the NDP - the pdf on the website, it states clearly that transport - as it is - will do the job. Bit lax that.
Mihir Bose (on the Spurs Show) this week reckons the initial reason for going for the OS was to stop WH from getting it, with the intention of always pushing Haringey into action.
Not quite.