Let's all blame the pitch
Wednesday, August 18, 2010 at 6:55PM Saw this posted by Wriggly over at GG, which I found quite interesting. Only because its now blatantly obvious that the Young Boys cheated. THROW THEM OUT OF EUROPE ! How dare they trick Dawson into playing poorly. Hopefully Blatter was watching.
If anyone can verify these as facts, please go ahead and do so. I have not a clue.
The artificial surface is 5th Generation. This generation of surface has the ability to adjust the height of the 'grass' by millimeters lower or higher, so in winter when the surface is frosty/snowy they can raise it a few mm to help when playing. The surface has a self watering mechanism which leaves tiny beads of moisture on the surface, this helps to prevent injuries when sliding, studs being caught in the surface when its dry, and most commonly things like burns when sliding across the pitch. This Generation fo surface does not move, it used to be layed down in blocks, but this is in one big 'sheet' of turf.
The surface is designed in a way that you should be less susceptible to injuries like groin strains (we got 2 last night) - Although the surface is actually fairly thin, its layed down on shock absorption rubber mats which have been laid down on top of concrete to help with this. So essentially, this surface is better for you when playing football on that side of things. When I asked about our two injuries, he simply replied with 'they probably bottled it, its all in the mind' I bet your players are fit for next game.
Might be useless info for some, but thats some info about the surface.
When i asked about them watering the pitch on top of the self moisture feature, they said that's to benefit only the team that's used to playing on it. He is unsure if that is illegal as its gaining an advantage, but it is not very good sportsmanship.
Reader Comments (46)
The fact we were shite is obviously irrelevant in his little world.
As usual we dont have the mental toughness that we so need, hence we buckle when we play Man U, we need a leader on the pitch to give us a kick up the arse when were playing like that.
This explains perfectly why our players could not control the ball, seemed nervous and were comfortably two yards off of the pace. I hope we can put one over them at the Lane, but I'm not confident when you consider their away result from the last round...
i still think we are in need of a really experianced commited centre back. i didnt see dawson or bassong bossin the defence.. shouting for postion etc..
A leader? Someone to show some winning mentality? Gallas?
Ooooooh.....almost makes sense!
Excuses... excuses.
Okay, let's just ignore the fact that the players were slipping left right and centre (including Young Boys players who have played on it for years)
And as for Gallas providing leadership, hahahahaha. The man is a disruptive influence and would tear apart our dressing room
Your title is oozing with cheap shot cynicism, and I don’t like it.
Instead of making all the efforts to get to watch the fucking game and see facts for yourself, you are offering some la-la-land’s quotes from someone that either manufacture or sells this turf-shit.
IMO, the pitch is the basic reason for Spurs playing shitty in the first half. And this is fact to me and not some lame excuse.
:)
Can someone draw up a list of all visiting European teams in competitive games v Young Boys so we can see if any other club has struggled to get to grips with them. Excusing the pun there.
That is a lame excuse!!
Beetle, you can not be serious?
"And as for Gallas providing leadership, hahahahaha. The man is a disruptive influence and would tear apart our dressing room".
Gallas was successfully captaining Arse’s team until he refuse to back down and resigned his captaincy because of ridiculous of a betrayal by the egotistical boss who left him out to dry. From that time on, Arse team defensive plays were a joke and we almost caught them for the third place. From newspapers account I sense that HR rates him quite high and would like to ad him to the team. Also, he scored more goals from set pieces than all our defenders together. If Garry think so and fet him – it’s fine with me.
Thudd never made a mistake... Everyone is crap that means apart from Hud? Anyway we need palacios to leave tottenham.
.....fooking keyboard.... and my poor vision doesn’t help either….. :)
I meant Harry ....to get Gallas....
og, never mind :)
Ollie;
Take a look at Sutter's interview on Sky Sport. The guy appeared to be honest when he said things about the turf and YB’s attempt to take advantage of it and even excessively watering it to make it more difficult for us.
Fortunately, we got a grip of it in the second half and were able to salvage our hopes.
As for my comments to Spooky, I was just trying to pull his leg (NOT A FINGER). :)
I'm a sadist. I'm going to watch the game again.
Although we were about as potent as a Arjen Robben after playing roshambo for a week constantly and generally devoid of all ideas, I can't help but wonder that the pitch did play a part. I would rather we were just clear cut dog shit, because i've sounded like a mongy gooner at work today, reluctantly making up excuses for the embarressing performance. I guess we'll know in a weeks time whether or not that was the case, but until then I will reserve my judgement.
It was depressing, I spoke to my old man today about it and he said it gave him chest pains.
Yes it's true that the pitch was a disadvantage. Exactly how much of a disadvantage was down to how much the players let it get to them. The reason we played better int he 2nd half was probably because Harry threatened to knife someone at half time (thank god). The fact they all had this big moaning session the day before the game is an extremley worrying sign. It's like they went into the game on a massive negative, expecting to lose. Harry's reaction to the goals said it all. He looked like he was kind of expecting it.
From the first minute you could tell something was up. It just wasn't right. To be 3-0 down after half hour is more then just the pitch, and they all know it. Dawson and Harry said as much - yeah, the pitch was bad, but its no excuse for how badly the team played.
However much of a factor it was, we get no points or goals for being disadvantaged. We needed to show charachter and fightong spirit, which eventually we did. Hopefully they will all learn from this, and learn that a lot of times, everything will go against you, but you still have to be the big man and come through and get results. Man U or Chelsea would have come out of it ok, purely because of their 'win whatever' mentality. They would simply not allowed themselves to be 'spooked' as much as we did. Last night was another step on the learning curve for us. .
As for the pitch, is it supposed to be better or worse than the England indoor training place at Charlton? Cos I've played there and it's pretty good. It's 'artificial grass'
It's common-place for the home team to do everything to disadvantage the visitors, and has been that way for decades.
The most obvious way is to make the away dressing room very uncomforable and unwelcoming.
I remember playing at WHL as the "visiting team" and seeing inside the "home" dressing room - and it was vastly different.
Manager's will usually also instruct the groundsman to ensure the grass is a certain length too, and most will also water the pitch to make the ball move more quickly.
The reality of it all is that we have a 2nd leg to come, playing on a GRASS pitch, somewhat unfamiliar to Young Boys and so things should favour us a little more.
To be honest Im not even thinking of that game anymore Im currently in the process of filing it away somewhere deep deep down in my brain under the heading - nightmare just forget about it-.
All I care about now is when we get these little upstarts back to our place for round 2.
I expect the following from this encounter and if I dont get it I'll be one angry Tottenham fan.
1) Victory in the tie - non-negotiable- make it happen Harry just make it happen.
2) A solid, composed, passing performance with a ruthless end product.
3)The correct team selection, taking fitness into account all our big hitters start in their proper positions along with Robbie up front.
4) Robbie has to start am sick of Defoe missing sitters and generally contributing nothing when he isnt scoring which has been for a while now.
5) When they come off the pitch I want faith to have been restored in our beloved Tottenham, I want YB's to be bloodied, bowed and broken.
I demand the above, make it happen Harry, make it happen lads.
COYS
So did we choke or not? we had a horrid run at the end of last season where everyone said we would bottle it but we didn't did we?
Arsenal
Chelsea
MAN CITY AWAY (billed as the 30m game)
We won all of those games, nobody said we would BUT WE DID. So I can't accept people telling me today Spurs couldn't handle the pressure, we choked last night?
Or maybe we did? I can't remember Dawson and Bassong playing so badly, both looked so flat footed...these guys were class last season keeping nearly a club RECORD of clean sheets together. I just think Spurs started so slowly and before the knew it we were 2-0 down. I can't understand why we started slowly though???? How on earth could the lads not be up for it? Was it the CL music that got to them, did the ocassion get to them? I But surely this would drive them on? It's hard to figure out what was the cause of out poor performance. It has to be said that Young Boys have just defeated Fenerbahce and last season beat Althletico Bilbao over two legs so these guys are not mugs no matter what the evil Gooners think. I remember the draw for this game and Spurs fans I know over the moon about pulling Young Boys out of that hat. Not for one minute did I think this would be a walk in the park. It was always going to be a tight game. What hurt the most was going 3-0 down after working our bollocks off last season to reach this game. Nine months of work gone in 30 mins! I really hope we put in a huge performance next week and turn up. )We did only three days ago against City. The players let us down last night and I felt sorry for poor old Harry. Two away goals though might just give us a chance.....two games into the new season and I've already aged 10 yrs!!!! Come on lads, you didn't do yourselves justice last night and you must put it right....
Whatever disadvantage there was or not, at the end, I’m glad Spurs came out of this “jail” with only our pride a bit bruised, and a chance to make things right in a week time, and show YB we are no fucking Fenerbahce.
I have been thinking about this game all summer, praying we wouldn't blow it. Thank God those two goals still give us a chance. Maybe we should of bought a couple of new players before this tie to try and help us but to be fair if our players turn up we know what we can do. I can stand it! I want next Wednesday to be tomorrow but on the other hand I don't!!!! ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! Please make it happen Spurs.
Perspective here is simple. We are the young ones, the inexperienced and we are walking onto new ground with each passing day. It's been Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool for so long now who can blame us for a little bit of the nervy nerves? We've learnt a lesson and now we have to ready ourselves for the biggest game of our lives.
If and it's a big if we do get through then maybe away from home we will flood that midfield (4-5-1) and not play such a high line in the defence. We must learn from this.
Lets face it this tie has been a nightmare from the start. When we got them in the draw we knew nothing about them but who wanted to put 'Young Boys Switzerland' into Google?? We now have to put up with headlines like ' Spurs need to spank 'Young Boys at The Lane'. Role on next week so we can show them how we really can play and put these 'Young Boys' to bed. D'OH !!!
During the world cup Ol Arry went mental about Fabio playing 4-4-2 against foreign oppsition. What I dont understand is why he then decided to use this formation, when the players he has can adapt to a 4-2-3-1 0r 4-5-1 formation, WTF!!!! He either didnt watch Young Boys last season or thought we would cruise (despite the fact that they beat Fenerbache). In europe we see the prefereed fomations 4-5-1 and 4-3-3, which the former, is being used by teams to defend with and the latter to attack / counter attack plays. Fuck me , its that bloody obvious, i dont know what the fuck they (the management ) were thinking of.
Blaming the pitch is a poor fucking excuse from our team. We often hear players say they want pitches to be like a carpet (like an astro turf pitch). No bobbles here mate, the pitch is as smooth as a young boys bottom!! Huddlestone said it best "if you are accurate with your passing the pitch is not a problem". Spurs couldnt pass and were not up for the fight compared to Young Boys. (Note the back pass from Palacios to Gomes. Shit back pass, Dawson falls asleep, Bienvenu runs straight past him, Palacios WATCHES, YES WATCHES, the calamity he has caused, leaving Bienvenu who is now 5 yards ahead of flat footed Dawson, running towards goal. Gomes forces him wide then they move. what the fuck happened to their concentration?? If a young kids team done that, you could understnd but fucking professionals...tut tut!!!!
Dawson doesnt not have the defnsive acumen and brain to et a proper grip and hold of his defencedespite him having a good season last year. In Champions League , this has to be improved because we know King aint going to playing many matches. Dawson should take a coaching course!!!
We still need a CB but to get Gallas , I feel is ridiculous idea. Experience yes but what we need is organisation and pace as well. We got skinned at the back so often last night and as Drogba said " it's a fucking disgrace!!!
Spurs pull your finger out, concentrate, so we dont have to be oin this situation again.
COYS!!
People keep mentioning Young boys performance in the last round of qualifiers but fail to mention they played a team that were down to 10 men for around 90 mins of the two legs. Fenerbache had a player sent off in the first leg just before half time, and one in the second leg just after half time. Its hardly a barometer to use!
They played well on home soil, on a pitch even their own players admit gave them and advantage and are already well ahead in terms of fitness with their season under way earlier than ours. Im not saying spurs are going to spank them next game but a bit of perspective is needed.
Harry made it pretty clear in his quote after the game that the pitch had 'got into their heads'. The didn't play with confidence cos they were thinking about the pitch the whole time. Incidentally I'm not blaming the pitch here, I'm saying the players need to be more adaptable than that:- A below par performance might be excused but that first half an hour was awful (although their first goal was just very lucky,it bounced off about 3 players, one offside..). Still I'm confident about the next leg...can we just put the ball in the net a bit more though: someone needed to be getting on the end of bale's crosses last night, cos you can't expect much better balls in than those!
What irritates me the most is the way we all get together and discuss how bad Tottenham's performance really was. We started of poor, the way we usually do away and then slowly absorb the pressure then start to play. The real problem was Dos SanTOSS and a very poor Corluka on the right hand side. IF we play Dos SanTOSS we expect him to cut inside and play his football... HOWEVER, we need someone at right back running forward supporting him and applying pressure to their fullback.. and there was none of that, no stability. I for one, HATE making excuses but it was just a poor line up who could not adapt and of course the pitch which the players were frightened of. Lets forget about the past and focus on the future.. SPURS keep the best defensive home record and the Young Boys he NO CHANCE.. i expect Modric and the HUDD to start in the middle with Bale and Lennon on the flanks.. GAME OVER! Defoe = useless, a complete flat track bully who'll score 2 vs Stoke and then turn up on tuesday and feel hes done enough with out scoring.. NEW STRIKER please Harry! COYS
Look, they're PROFESSIONAL footballers, and professional footballers get the job done when the time comes. Doesn't matter if the pitch is some torn up sod debacle or a parking lot. Jesus Christ, I don't give a shit if it's made of fucking fire and patrolled by demons. Just deer in the fucking headlights, afraid to move, afraid to react, afraid to do anything.
Palacios was awful and I'm not sure I saw Bale or Pav touch the ball until after Huddlestone came into the match. Every game, if you get it wide to Bale, he can just flat out torch right backs. You wanna stop Degen coming down the side. give A-E the help he so richly needed? Fucking attack right back up the flank. The back four were pretty awful, but they had no midfield support as the rest of the squad stood about like a crowd of thirteen year olds at their first dance. And Dos Santos?!! Not the venue, Harry.
I take my hat off to Huddlestone. He was easily the man of the match, and, if they progress, should probably just be named player of the year right then. Just brought so much poise onto the pitch and from that point on I felt like we had the better of it, especially since 14 on Boys couldn't hit the side of a barn. Coming back to White Hart, where they're a whole nother squad, and all they've gotta do is win by 1. Well, it's certainly doable...
I expect great things from Thudd this year. Looking good so far I think
beetle , Gallas is a grade a cunt and a very disruptive influence in every dressing room he visits ... Remember how shameless his behavior was at the Arse , he has problems with younger players all the time (Nasri and others) even his teammate Vermaelen wasn't at all sorry to see him go (said so in the belgian press) and in the French team it's the same story all over again ...
Bringing Gallas in would be a huge mistake.
Just a quick question to people who blame the pitch......
Did we play on a different pitch in the second half?
It took a while for the players to get used to the pitch but the main reason for the early debacle is that YB have already played 7 league games; they were clearly fitter, faster and more alert. I think that any of the Prem teams would have struggled against them. Expect King to start next Wednesday and all to be well in the end.
Nayim, I agree, they were fitter, and closed us down brilliantly. They knocked the ball around us unbelievably at times.
I dont think they will be able to do that at our place.
Did anyone else feel really dirty wanting Keane to come on in the second half? I know i did.
I don't know if I felt "dirty" so much as absurdly and irrationally hopeful that he might somehow be on the road to recovering his old form.
I'm starting to worry about the lack of depth on the squad and am wondering if our loss the other night put a nail in the coffin to the scenario some ITK-ers have put out of a Forlan-esque talisman waiting to see if we progress in CL before committing.
I won't be the first one to say that we need a finisher. With JD, Pav and Crouchie being a bit flat--I find myself hoping against all rationality that Keano could become that person again.
Okay, now I feel dirty
:)
Actually I take back the 'lack of depth' somewhat
I think we have a lot of depth in most positions
And in theory we do have depth in our very good but not quite world-class level strikers. We just need a couple of them to step things up a bit.
I was a bit worried about Keane coming on, if we are indeed looking to sell him. Now he is cup tied for European competitions. As a player I have nothing but admiration for him, as if the (Liverpool) situation was reversed and I was him, I would have joined spurs in a heart beat. He still has the quality, he just lost the fire in his belly, but he says he got that back at celtic and I believe him, his pre-season and performance when he came on was good considering the circumstances. I still think he will be most likely to leave though, either him or pav, now defoe is out we may need him more than we realise. What ever happens if Harry gets his way one of our current crop of strikers is out of the door. Read this, just came up on newsnow (Redknapp: I need four players to complete my Tottenham dream team):
http://www.hamhigh.co.uk/content/camden/hamhigh/sport/story.aspx?brand=NorthLondon24&category=Sportspurs&tBrand=northlondon24&tCategory=sport&itemid=WeED18+Aug+2010+16:33:41:993
He says he has a forward target but he already has 4, insinuating he must get rid of one. When he talks of the four players I believe he is referring to helb (Not Cup Tied), Gallas (Not Cup Tied), Fabiano (Is Cup Tied) and someone else, probably another forward as he says two of his targets might be for one position.
Great debate lads but really Spurs are like the my favourite quote on T-shirts "You Live and then....You Die". It's just that supporting Spurs you get to do it every season. Now isn't that a good deal?
What a great nick you have , yidiots , i truely believe that you should start a blog of your own,what whit that kind of creativity you would become a hit overnight ...
On another note : Remy has signed at Marseille.
Remy - gone, Fabiano - Cup Tied, Suarez - Cup Tied. Harry said he went scouting at the Ivory Coast/Italy game too so perhaps he is looking at Gervinho, although he could be cup tied if he plays for Lille tonight. God I wish I knew who he wanted.
On another good note I see that Internacional won the Copa Libertadores last night. Bodes well for Sandro! Get him over here now quick!!
Gervinho - in my opinion he is not that good, and not really a Centre Forward. Much more likely he was looking at Quagliarella...hopefully anyway.
Shahaan
You are right about Giovani/Corluka. I said in a post on a previous topic that Corluka shuould play behind lennon only and if Lennon aint playin Walker or Kaboul should be rb. (makes sense to me!) If kaboul was playin rb he would have been able to support Gio better.
I dont know where you watched the match but I watched it on TV3 in Ireland and during the match (I think we were one down at the time) you could clearly hear Harry shouting "gio get off the line, play in the hole"
Gio at that time was glued to the line so saying "IF we play Dos SanTOSS we expect him to cut inside and play his football..." is not strictly true...he was told in this case by Harry to come off the wing.
Anyway this doesn't really matter because we'll be playin on real grass on Wednesday and the lads will have their heads on straight. Lennon complained during training on Monday that the synthetic surface was hurting his joints. He's been out of sorts since his injury last December and his head is not right. He needs to be given the ball constantly in the first 20 mins and run the hell out of Spycher to get his confidence up. I'd play Corluka behind him as they have a very good understanding of each others game/positioning.
I'd start Keane and Pav for the 2nd leg because I'm fed up with Defoe not producing when it matters. Its all very well scoring 5 against Wigan but we need a clinical finisher who can score goals when it REALLY matters ( i know it matters all the time but you know what I mean) and playing Crouch means we bypass midfield play by lumping it up to his head.
Honestly the pitch didnt help on Tuesday. I know they trained on it Monday but thats nothing to playing a full tempo match. The pace of the ball is different and takes a while to get used to. Have you ever seen our passing so poor. 2nd half was better when we got to grips with it and Thud came on and settled us down at the end of the 1st half. YB's came out of the blocks quick and hit the ground running we were not prepared and psychologically were a mess.
After watching this game I realised that it was just like the Burnley Carling Cup Semi a few years ago. We'd smashed them 4-1 at ours and then went 3-0 down. Luckily we found the testicular fortitude to bring it back and go through. Ironically I think it was pav that made it 3-2 that night too. Hopefully we'll do them 4-1 at ours on wednesday